No free version anymore?

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Biff
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No free version anymore?

Post by Biff »

Is FileBot not free anymore?
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

Nothing in life is free.
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Biff
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by Biff »

Oops, is that what Konfuzius says? I didn't know that. That's a really cool wisdom.

But what does it mean referring to my question?
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

It means that FileBot costs me time and money, and I am now passing on a tiny little bit to each individual user. Actually, since about 3 years ago on Mac, and 1 year ago on Windows. It's not exactly news. :lol:

:idea: Previous versions of FileBot were donation supported, not free per se. Unfortunately, most users assumed that donation supported means free, so now I'm using a simple paid software model.
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Biff
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by Biff »

Well, alright, OK, of course, I completely understand, why not, that is a good idea, if I had a program I would sell it for very much money as well, I'd never give it for free of course.
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jollyroger
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by jollyroger »

So let me get this right. A paid app that helps you organize your pirated goods... Image
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

More like an app that saves you time, when renaming files on your computer. ;)
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Razorman
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by Razorman »

rednoah wrote: 07 Mar 2018, 14:33 Nothing in life is free.
With all due respect, you're wrong. Linux is free, the vast majority of open-source software is free. Maybe you have to pay in terms of time to learn the software, but you have to do the same with paid software as well.

Also FileBot used to be free (for Windows anyway), and now it's not because... you say so? Surely you know how the Internet works, how all your previous versions are still available on SourceForge. Anyone who wants newer versions on Windows will obviously need to buy the Store version, and that's fine. But you're being flippant by saying "nothing in life is free".

The honest thing to do would state that people are free to download a previous version on SF if they want, but if they want newer versions with updated feature and bug fixes, they'll need to buy it. You're just hoping people aren't proactive and won't start doing the research themselves.
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

Razorman wrote: 24 May 2018, 01:21 With all due respect, you're wrong. Linux is free, the vast majority of open-source software is free. Maybe you have to pay in terms of time to learn the software, but you have to do the same with paid software as well.
Do you think the people working on Linux are not getting paid and are only working on Linux in their spare time on the weekend in addition to their full time jobs? Ask Google. ;) (Pun intended.)

Razorman wrote: 24 May 2018, 01:21 Also FileBot used to be free (for Windows anyway), and now it's not because... you say so?
FaceBook didn't make money and didn't try to make money for the first 10 years. Because Zuckerberg just said so one day? No, it's because Facebook (just as myself) at some point just had to make money to justify all the investments made into development and maintenance of the product.

FileBot has been trying to monetize in one way or another for more than 7 years. Around 2015, I came to the conclusion that a simple paid software model is the only reasonable way forward. The alternative would have been to sunset FileBot and let it wither and die, putting my time and energy into other projects.

e.g. FileBot for Mac went from "barely usable" in 2014 to "works really well" in 2015 because I bought a MacBook and spent a large amount of time to make it work well, so that I could start selling it on the Mac App Store.

Razorman wrote: 24 May 2018, 01:21 Surely you know how the Internet works, how all your previous versions are still available on SourceForge. Anyone who wants newer versions on Windows will obviously need to buy the Store version, and that's fine. But you're being flippant by saying "nothing in life is free".
The previous releases are there because they're there. I can't go back in time and take them back. Those builds predate FileBot becoming paid software. I could remove them from SF, but what would be the point of that? However, I also don't plan on publishing new builds, and so these older builds are completely unsupported and may or may not work in the future as they're not maintained and might break in the future as the internet changes.

Razorman wrote: 24 May 2018, 01:21 The honest thing to do would state that people are free to download a previous version on SF if they want, but if they want newer versions with updated feature and bug fixes, they'll need to buy it. You're just hoping people aren't proactive and won't start doing the research themselves.
That would be dishonest. I will not and cannot recommend using older builds, because they may not work well, and may not work at all in the future. It would seem like bait and switch tactics from a users point of view who starts using a free product which then unexpectedly breaks (which undoubtedly I'd be accused of causing) and is then asked to upgraded to a paid working product.

Razorman wrote: 24 May 2018, 01:21 You're just hoping people aren't proactive and won't start doing the research themselves.
Yes. The target market of FileBot is people for whom time is worth money.




:idea: My official stance is that you need to purchase FileBot if FileBot can be purchased on your particular platform, i.e. Windows 10 and macOS. However, on any other platform were selling FileBot is not feasible for me anyway, be it Windows 7 / Windows Server / Linux / FreeBSD / etc, you can do whatever you want, but you'll be on your own in terms of build and support.

:idea: I am experimenting with Patreon to make FileBot for Linux happen in a "kinda free but users are actually paying for it" kinda way.
:idea: Please read the FAQ and How to Request Help.
rpgmaker
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rpgmaker »

rednoah wrote: 24 May 2018, 06:25
Razorman wrote: 24 May 2018, 01:21 The honest thing to do would state that people are free to download a previous version on SF if they want, but if they want newer versions with updated feature and bug fixes, they'll need to buy it. You're just hoping people aren't proactive and won't start doing the research themselves.
That would be dishonest. I will not and cannot recommend using older builds, because they may not work well, and may not work at all in the future. It would seem like bait and switch tactics from a users point of view who starts using a free product which then unexpectedly breaks (which undoubtedly I'd be accused of causing) and is then asked to upgraded to a paid working product.
You're being obtuse here. Just posting a link to older versions and clearly stating that they're now unsupported would be the honest way to go. Doing this it's not new, especially in the FLOSS world. I'm sure the kind of users that actually go out of their way to find and use your application would be able to deal with that. You don't realize it but you're on a defensive mindset, this usually happens when projects that used to be (effectively) free start to charge people. Don't get defensive. I say this as someone who donated to the project before it was compulsory.
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

1.
FileBot is $20 on the Windows and Mac App Store. I stand by that. However, lack of commercial support for other platforms is unfortunate. I do feel sorry for Windows 7 and Linux users that want to purchase FileBot but can't. There's no technical reason for that, hence I'm on the defensive there.


2.
I'm actively working on my own traditional licensing system, so that I can offer FileBot (paid) for any and all platforms that can run FileBot. It's necessary for Linux, but it's viable because of Windows 7 users. Let's see how it goes. I'll be a lot happier if I can offer FileBot to everyone, and not just Windows 10 and Mac users.


3.
I will most certainly not advertise deprecated builds, that are already partially broken, and will completely break in the not so distant future. People using deprecated builds builds just leads to support requests (linked because posted today) and a general waste of time for everyone.

I understand the confusion about older builds being available for free still, but there's reason to keep them around for now for users that otherwise wouldn't be able to use FileBot at all.
:idea: Please read the FAQ and How to Request Help.
nickodemos
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by nickodemos »

Must admit that I have had the same knee jerk reaction many haver had with you going to pay to use policy after such a long time it being free to use. I even backed off using it since then. Came back and was looking for free version again as I use your program vary rarely.

But came to the conclusion that US $6.00 a year is not a bad price to use the program. Might get more if it was US $4.00 a year. Still less than a fast food meal so I jumped aboard.

Is it possible to get a reduced rate through the store if you bought a year license?
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

1.
Unfortunately, there is now officially now more free version regardless of platform, not even for Linux. It's not a simple paid purchase on any platform.

2.
The 6 USD price tag includes local tax and paddle fees. The base price would be around 4-5 USD depending on your region.

3.
The Microsoft / Apple Store purchases are completely separate from the new license model. These purchases are only available as a one-time life-time purchase (since the Store doesn't support anything else) but will only work for the platform (i.e. Windows or macOS) that a given Store platform, and may have limitations depending on what the given Store allows (e.g. no command-line tools on the Mac App Store). Hence the Microsoft / Apple Store price is half (excl. 30% store fee) of the standalone multi-OS license. If you only use one OS, then it's a bargain. However, the new license model (and not the platform store) is the best choice if you use Windows and macOS, or if you use Linux.
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atc98092
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by atc98092 »

I had to register just to respond to this thread. I use FileBot a lot (obviously, the older free version), and have recommended it on many forums. I felt I should support its development, and went into the Microsoft Store this morning to purchase it. Imagine my shock seeing a price of $39.99! :o Especially since it was posted more than once in this thread that the price is $19.99. Even that price seems a bit high, but I might have accepted that. But not $40. Sorry, it's just not worth it. Now if that price is in error in the store, please let me know and I'll reconsider. But for now I'll look for something more reasonably priced.

I completely understand the need to receive payment for your hard work. I've done coding, and I know the level of effort that goes into it. But please reconsider the asking price in the Microsoft Store.
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

Have you considered going for the affordable 1 year license for 6 USD instead of going for an expensive life-time license?

:arrow: https://www.filebot.net/purchase.html



:idea: The new short-term / long-term license model allows me to offer affordable short-term licenses in exchange for expensive long-term licenses, which makes it much easier for new users to get started, and allows for continuous support for long-term users.

:idea: The Microsoft Store supports only life-time licenses and is thus priced accordingly. You can purchase and download FileBot directly from our website if you go for the affordable 1 year universal license option.
:idea: Please read the FAQ and How to Request Help.
letthiswork1
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by letthiswork1 »

Rednoah,

You spend a lot of time on this application and support so many different people.

I think its very fair you want to charge for this.

Thank you for everything

Hopefully you make a bit more money and can dedicate some more time to improvements ^.^
alvintc
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by alvintc »

I bought the lifetime (actually bought it back in summer).

It's $40... that doesn't seem unreasonable to me.
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

Much appreciated. ;)
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jen729w
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by jen729w »

Oh man, some of you are ungrateful.

I'm guessing you've never poured hours of your life in to a thing, to find out that others also find that thing useful, to think that perhaps you could earn a little money from all of these hours.

You think everything should be free, but I bet you don't work for free. It's pathetic.

Thank you, Rednoah. I appreciate your work and I am happy to pay for it. It saves me time, and I appreciate that.

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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

jen729w wrote: 07 Dec 2018, 20:49 I appreciate your work and I am happy to pay for it. It saves me time, and I appreciate that.
Much appreciated. That's the value proposition right there. ;)
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EchoApeiron
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by EchoApeiron »

Your software isn't that great... just another example of a sellout. Go fuck yourself rednoah
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

EchoApeiron wrote: 13 Jan 2020, 05:21 Your software isn't that great... just another example of a sellout. Go fuck yourself rednoah
It totally is the greatest, and totally worth it, because time is more precious than money. But if that's not immediately obvious to you, then I invite to to be on your merry way elsewhere. ;)
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devster
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by devster »

alvintc wrote: 03 Dec 2018, 12:54 I bought the lifetime (actually bought it back in summer).

It's $40... that doesn't seem unreasonable to me.
I did too.
However, I felt a bit like finding out that the linux kernel is now paid software and has now become closed-source.
I only work in black and sometimes very, very dark grey. (Batman)
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rednoah
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by rednoah »

devster wrote: 14 Jan 2020, 09:44 However, I felt a bit like finding out that the linux kernel is now paid software and has now become closed-source.
Well, open-source is great for the development of all the "raw materials" that still need further processing to eventually get baked into commercially viable products. That's why all the corporate sponsors (e.g. Google, Samsung, Red Hat, etc) are more than happy to fund the Linux Foundation and / or payroll their own kernel developers. ;)
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molnizzle
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Re: No free version anymore?

Post by molnizzle »

rednoah wrote: 25 Sep 2018, 02:52 Have you considered going for the affordable 1 year license for 6 USD instead of going for an expensive life-time license?

:arrow: https://www.filebot.net/purchase.html

:idea: The new short-term / long-term license model allows me to offer affordable short-term licenses in exchange for expensive long-term licenses, which makes it much easier for new users to get started, and allows for continuous support for long-term users.

:idea: The Microsoft Store supports only life-time licenses and is thus priced accordingly. You can purchase and download FileBot directly from our website if you go for the affordable 1 year universal license option.
Nobody wants a subscription for basic utilities like this. People hate to even subscribe to Adobe software. Just look at the success Serif has had with their Affinity suite of software. They're siphoning Adobe users left and right for one simple reason -- people hate subscriptions for basic tools that don't substantially change over time.

I've used FileBot for years with a $9 purchase on the Mac App Store. That was a fair price I was happy to pay. Now on my Windows PC I see it's $30-something on sale. That's absolutely ridiculous for a basic utility like this. I felt kinda stupid even paying $9 for it and now I need to pay again. $20 would have been a cash grab, but I'd have sucked it up.

The current price is out of line. Affinity Photo -- a legitimate, full commercial Photoshop replacement -- has an MSRP of $50 for what you call a "lifetime license." Your little file renamer costs 80% of that. Utterly ridiculous price.
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